[Vanhackspace] hacker dojo

[Joe Bowser]

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Luke Closs wrote:
> On Sat, Apr 25, 2009 at 6:11 PM, Jeff Davis <jeff at textsfornothing.com>wrote:
> 
>> And for people making a decent wage, $50 for 24/7 access to a
>> workshop (or $25 for moderate-to-heavy use without a key) seems like a
>> pretty good deal.
>>
> 
> In fact it's a ridiculously cheap deal!
> 
> I guess I just worry that a few people paying $50/month isn't going to be
> enough to cover a $2000-3000/month operating budget.

I don't think membership alone will ever cover our costs.  We've
mentioned this the last time we discussed this issue.  Jacking up the
fees so that it's unaffordable to practically everyone isn't the
solution.  All that does is kill the whole thing, because nobody can
afford it.  I think we can acknowledge that the first six months of a
new space will have to be run at a loss and it will require some
dedicated people to put in more money than their $50 to get it off the
ground until the $50/month (and more likely the $25/month) memberships
start taking the pressure off.

Remember that instead of it just being one day a week, this will be an
actual space with stuff happening at it all the time.  Tuesday sucks for
a lot of people, and I think if there was stuff happening at another
time during the week, a lot more people will show up.  Right now, we're
only doing things once a week, and we maxed Tuesday out.  We can't even
fit our programming in Tuesday.  (With Arduino and Kit night, we only
have two nights devoted to other topics, one software and one hardware.)

In short, not everyone wants to be at the hackerspace ALL the time.  But
there are tons of people who want a hackerspace to exist, and if they
could make it to a hackerspace on a day that's good for them, they'll be
willing to pay for that.  Right now the people that are paying are
paying because they're awesome!

Furthermore, here are things that we can charge for:
- - Materials
- - Tool Usage
- - Beverages
- - Event Rental
- - Non Open House Drop-In (IMO, Tuesday should be the only day that will
be free, and only because it's in the pattern!)

None of these are big numbers, but given that this can increase given
the number of people who use the space, I think it's worth considering
as well.

Once we have a space, we have a space and we can monetize that space.
That can mean renting out offices, that can also mean having it booked
for outside classes, and it also means having it available for various
gatherings and fundraisers.

> 
> I also am a bit skeptical that the lazer will be a huge money maker (I'd
> love to be proven wrong).  

The laser won't make a profit until it's paid off.  However, we already
had people offer us money for time on the laser and we don't even have
the thing yet.  I have confidence that it will pay itself off, but will
not be a huge part of the budget. (Maybe $200/month)

I heard goldfish suggest we build and sell
> little things for $5 or something (I forget the context).  I think that's
> not worth our time.  

I think that it's worth our time as far as outreach and making sure we
have those $25/month people coming into the space.  They're members and
unless the economy has really hit the shitter, $25 is still greater than
$0 by about 25 dollars.

IMO, 6 people paying $500/month is not sustainable in the long term,
where 120 people all paying $25 is more sustainable.  The 6 people at
$500 is great for bootstrapping a space, but if we don't actually get
more people, it's not going to happen, and we'll close in 6 months.  I
personally think we'll probably have about 40 members, and will be able
to scrape by with fundraising and other revenue (and by scrape by, I
mean have 3 months rent in the bank), but only if we get a space and
concentrate on getting people to check it out.

Given how many times we've decided to not do outreach because we're at
capacity, this is exactly why I'm not as worried about if people will
show up.  (I'm more worried about us not getting the word out once we
get the space, and people not showing up because they don't know we
exist.  That WILL kill us.)

If we want to make money selling something (that will
> substantially benefit VHS), we need to A) sell 100's, and B) have a pretty
> decent markup.  I think it's totally doable to start selling one or more
> kits, perhaps partially assembled.

I think we should make the kits and sell them both online, and at the
space as part of classes.  I don't think we're in an either/or position
at this point. A unit moved is a unit moved.

In short, we can't afford to price ourselves out of the reach of our
perspective members.  We also have to get people confirmed as people who
are willing to put down a one time donation, or an ongoing monthly
donation greater than $50.  Once we're incorporated, and once we have
the space lined up, that's the next thing that we should do.

Do people want to talk about this this Tuesday?  This might be too
important to leave to IRC/Email, and I don't think we talk about the
money situation enough.

Joe
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